• Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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      4 months ago

      Maybe so, and this may be callous of me, but I would not sacrifice my daughter over them. I don’t know whether or not you are a parent, but I don’t think many parents would be willing to sacrifice their children because others wanted them sacrificed.

        • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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          4 months ago

          Are you a parent? Because otherwise, I don’t think you really understand why I feel this way.

          • PugJesus@lemmy.world
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            4 months ago

            Do you lack empathy for other parents and other children? Do you expect them to die to save you and your’s, or will you just expect enough of them to die to stall for the duration of your lifetimes? How direct does your contribution to the deaths of others have to be? If your daughter was held hostage, would you go to the camps every day and pull the lever on the gas chambers, or would that be ‘too much’?

            My mother loves me, and I know she’d die to save my dumb ass. She’d kill a few people at the least too. But I also know she would be deeply ashamed of me if I was bound by common morality to assist in the prevention of a great evil, and chose instead to flee - not just spur of the moment, but continually, every day of my life, until either the evil was successful in its genocide or until other people paid the price on my behalf.

            Could you look your daughter in the eyes, and tell her a hundred children raped to death were the price to not risk her life? Not even a guaranteed trade, just not to risk her life? What other risks to her life are unacceptable?

            • Flying Squid@lemmy.worldM
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              4 months ago

              I’ll take that as a no.

              The need to protect your offspring doesn’t just transcend species, it transcends kingdoms.

              There are trees that will protect their offspring.

              I’m sorry, but trying to reason or shame me into abandoning my parental need to protect my offspring that goes back literally billions of years is not something you’re going to be able to do. There is a long, long history of parents begging their children not to go to war.

              • PugJesus@lemmy.world
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                4 months ago

                The need to protect your offspring doesn’t just transcend species, it transcends kingdoms.

                Cool, the need to reproduce also transcends kingdoms, but I wouldn’t be making moral arguments for reproducing at any cost either.

                I’m sorry, but trying to reason or shame me into abandoning my parental need to protect my offspring that goes back literally billions of years is not something you’re going to be able to do. There is a long, long history of parents begging their children not to go to war.

                There’s also a long, long history of parents shaming or even killing their own children for not going to war for a just cause. This idea of a child being worth committing any evil to save is very modern. You can claim that it’s something that you could never fight, that it’s some biological imperative that takes precedence over everything else, but history, and fuck, recent examples for that matter, very clearly points to that being nothing but an excuse.

                  • PugJesus@lemmy.world
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                    4 months ago

                    I don’t remember making a moral argument. When did I do that? Can you please quote it?

                    If your argument isn’t that saving your child under these circumstances is moral, what you’re saying then, is that you recognize full well that what you’re proposing, since it is seemingly entirely without limits, is unforgivably evil, but you’re 100% okay with it anyway and have no interest in examining or questioning it.