And it’s crap across the OSes. On Linux laptops don’t wake up from sleep, on Windows they keep waking up when nobody asks for it.
In our home office room there’s three laptops. My private one running Fedora, my work PC that sadly runs Windows and my wife’s laptop also running Windows.
My work laptop and my wife’s laptop keep waking up wasting electricity, and my private laptop needs a hard reset to wake it up every second time.
That feature should be stupid simple, yet it doesn’t work across the board.
Rant over.
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Never had I problems with sleep. Neither with arch, suse, fedora nor ubuntu. Neither with Gnome nor with kde.
Not even with windows.
Must be the hardware (brand).
my guess is because the CPU power levels are fucking trashed because of all the patches they have to run at runtime. before Intel went all “wild west” with their security practices to improve performance, sleep worked just fine for me.
keep in mind, this was before uefi too, so it might also have a hand in the problems.
My laptop refuses to stay asleep if fstab disks were disconnected prior to sleeping. It works perfectly fine for me now that I figured that out.
Just one more weird behavior with fstab and kde or Linux or arch? I don’t know who to blame.
First thing I do on any OS, but especially linux, is turn off every sleep-related option permanently. I don’t care anymore. I won’t fight with it.
In 35 years of experience I’ve never got it to work correctly on any OS except IOS. I’ve only met ONE tech who claimed it worked for them, and that was in the 2000’s. He couldn’t demonstrate how exactly.
I do the same thing, turn that shit off because it does not work.
A few years ago Windows invented a new sleep state, s0ix, instead of the previous s3 state. This makes a laptop behave more like a phone, able to wake up when it receives new data.
Unfortunately this is usually implemented badly and also causing the removal or neglect of previously reliable s3 sleep.
It’s actually insane that the only company who I’ve noticed pull off s0 sleep properly is Apple with their MacBooks, which is sad. I understand they likely had already figured out how to do it properly by working on it for iOS but still, goddamn, it can’t be difficult to fix it elsewhere?
I understand Linux is a FOSS OS (and they kinda at the mercy of hardware manufacturers to upstream support for hardware) so I have no complaints there, but Microsoft that makes so much money can’t get people to fix it? I call bullshir.
I don’t think Microsoft cares
I unlocked my bios (luckily Lenovo allows that with just a “secret” key combination in the bios) and disabled modern sleep, enabled S3 and S2 and tried that, with the result that my Linux freezes every time on wake up instead of only half the time…
Don’t know what exactly they messed up there, but it’s frustrating.
What lenovo laptop do you have? I’ve had to use a special uefi tool to unlock mine
Lenovo LOQ 15ARP9.
To unlock, go to the BIOS, open advanced settings, hold FN+R+N, release, press F10 to save and reboot, head back to the BIOS and all options are unlocked.
Some Lenovo laptops have other key combinations, some need a tool, some need a modified BIOS.
Wait, are you suggesting it’s consistent and reliable on desktops?
Tbh, I don’t know. The last time I used a desktop on a daily basis was 2020, and that was just my work PC where I wouldn’t really care if it woke up while I wasn’t at work.
The last time I had a desktop PC at home was in 2009, so I really can’t say what is happening there in the meantime.
Interestingly, I do own a little 2010 netbook that I use as an ultra-mobile laptop when I really don’t need any kind of performance, and that one does all sleep states including hibernation perfectly out of the box. Even when just sleeping it loses maybe 1-2% of charge per day.
But all the other laptops I own suck when sleeping.
I’m roughly 25 years into using computers daily and never turning them off and I’ve never had or used a desktop that didn’t sleep and wake reliably, either naturally or using the sleep and wake buttons on the keyboard, with both Linux and Windows
Are you talking the full set of S0-S3 sleep as well as hibernation? Or just whatever your machine did by default? Because I’ve never had one do all of them correctly without freezing up or having some other issue, across multiple motherboard brands and BIOS updates and so forth. ~30 years here, Windows mostly then the last few on Linux.
Yep I’m with you. I’ve been under the assumption the “sleep” button is some sort of joke Microsoft includes just to mess with people. Never had it work reliably on desktop or laptop since it appeared
The problem is it’s not stupid simple, it’s actually fairly complicated. Each piece of hardware and its driver must be suspended. The GPU is a particularly tricky one. Its processor must be suspended, and the state saved. In the kernel, the driver must suspend its execution, and likewise save its state. Then on resume, each half has to reload and begin execution again. And if there’s any mismatch in the resumed states, the GPU and/or driver crash and probably take the kernel with it.
Now do that for the Wi-Fi, Bluetooth, sound card, USB, disk controller, and every other device.
This guy sleeps.
What are you talking about? This guy dies and comes back alive every time!
Are you talking about sleep, hibernate, or monitor off?
Sleep and hibernate don’t work for me.
Hibernate just acts like a power loss. After shutting down the state is just lost and the laptop starts up with a fresh boot.
With Modern Sleep, kernels 6.11+ go to sleep fine, but don’t manage to wake back up. The keyboard lights up for half a minute, the fan goes on, the screen stays dark and after half a minute the laptop goes back to sleep. Kernel 6.10 sometimes works, sometimes behaves like 6.11+. I’d say it works 80% of the time.
I disabled Modern Sleep in BIOS and tried to enable S3, S2 and S2+S3 in BIOS instead. I set the corresponding sleep states in Linux as well, and no matter which one of the non-modern-sleep options I try, and no matter if I’m using kernel 6.10 or 6.15, it never manages to wake up (same symptoms as above).
Yes
weirdly i have the windows problem on linux with my laptop: never have I had it not wake from sleep, but sometimes it starts overheating while on sleep and drains the battery super quick
many times ive put my laptop on sleep in my pouch, taken it out and hear the fans blasting, the laptop is burning hot and the battery lost 40% in 20 minutes
And it’s crap across the OSes.
Never had these problems with MacBooks. It’s probably one advantage of the OS and hardware being made by the same company.
I never had problems with sleep. Neither with fedora nor suse nor arch
Agreed. For all the downsides people point out with Mac’s, they handle this and battery life quite well. My daily driver is a Mac, and everything I connect to runs some flavor of Linux. Then there’s the Windows 11 thing my work foists upon me.
I noticed the same. The old macbook that I restored to become my ‘writing’ machine can sit asleep for a week (as I found out by accident) and just pops right up when opened. My windows and linux laptops have so many sleep issues.
That’s fair, never had one, so I can’t judge that.
Agreed, I disable sleep on all laptops other than my MacBook and my work laptop which manages to drain its battery and overheat itself on my bag semi frequently.
The MB has never had negative issues with sleep.
Macs aren’t immune to S0 sleep options. The Apple silicon CPUs are just so efficient that when it fails to fall to sleep it doesn’t matter. Intel ones it sucks balls when it fails.
Even my Intel MacBook Pro slept like a champ. They aren’t 100% immune but 99.95% I didn’t have an issue compared to my work windows laptop which was like 25% sleep worked and woke up correctly.
Hell, why is sleep so hard for most humans?
Absolutely unfair, I tell ya!
Stop judging, at least I made it to bed. It’s not my fault sleep can’t find me.
Narrator: It was.
Sleep is easy, you just prioritized that 30 minute YouTube video
I researched this in (checking notes) 2009 or so… things may have slightly changed since (and my memory is fading away)
At the time there was a standard for sleeping. Microsoft was part of the standard… and then they decided to implement in a different way (classic Microsoft, of course).
Hardware producers then adjusted to windows because… well… we were dozens of us using Linux on laptops.
This created issues in Linux because there were some purist developers that wanted to follow the standards, others that were more pragmatic and wanted to implement the windows way. In the end nothing worked.
Fast forward to today, windows waking up constantly I guess it’s broken as expected because it wants to allow background processes to do stuff. Linux not waking up sounds still the issue from 2009: there are multiple levels of sleep and the deepest was the most problematic. If I have to guess your laptop wakes up just fine if the battery is full and you left closed for few minutes… while it doesn’t when the battery is low-ish and/or you left sleeping for a longer period
It’s waking up because another device on the network (probably router) is pinging it
Disable “Wake on Magic Packet” and the Windows sleep issue goes away
This kind of stuff must happen at hardware level… wake on lan is in hardware.
Ethernet cards keep in getting packets (arp at very least) even if they are not directed for them. If the OS needs to check all packages it would be always on
That said… wake on lan is also a waste of energy if you don’t need (why powering the Ethernet cards?)
I have an old Dell XPS 13 sleep works great on for Linux probably can sleep a week or two and still have charge left when I open the lid. I have a newer framework and it’s dead in 2 days while “sleeping.”
I think the laptop really does matter, and it’s because chipsets are not all equal in how well their sleep modes are supported in the OS.
I’ve been buying XPS13s for over a decade; I’ve had four (three personal, and one requisitioned for me by my job), and sleep and suspend have worked almost flawlessly on them under Linux. In the office, most everyone else would move between meetings or to their desks with the lids almost closed, to prevent sleep and the problems it caused, but I’d just fearlessly close my lid; it was ironic to me that running Linux on the XPS I had more reliable sleep behavior than the Windows people on their laptops.
For OP: low power, initialization, and restoring state has to be implemented by each chip, and there are a lot of shitty, poorly implemented chips. Then the OS also has to store and restore state for each chipset, and even if the chip implements it well, the OS has to do a good job restoring power in the correct order and restoring the state for each chip. If anything goes wrong in either the chip or driver implementation, you get a broken state.
This is aggravated by the fact that Linux is a monolithic kernel, and if any device drivers get borked it usually borks the whole kernel. This wouldn’t be as bad a problem if Linux were a microkernel architecture and drivers could just be killed and restarted.
S0 standby is the problem. It’s a flawed idea from the start. The theory is it’s more “secure” or something. But like… Who cares about stealing shit from memory going from sleep to wake.
Now my laptop drops 20% charge in 5-10 minutes and goes into hibernation. It draws more power than if it’s on.
It’s not about security. It’s about maintaining a network connection so you can stream Spotify and receive Facebook updates while it’s “sleeping”. It’s fucking stupid.
Newer Dells have removed the s3 deep sleep. I believe the cutoff is between Intel 11th gen and 12th gen in (at least) Latitudes. I have a i7 12th gen that sucks at sleep, but an i5 8th gen that sleeps well.
Sleep function works pretty flawlessly on macOS. Always has. The hibernation function is pretty great, too.
On older Macs the light would pulse when sleeping in the same pattern as a human breathing while asleep.
I remember that. It was so cool.
I really miss when Apple made devices that had those awesome little touches. I still think Apple devices are pretty great, but they used to be better.
Same here. The hardware is still great but there’s not as much soul in the designs.
